07-09-2014 09:52 PM
Hi,
If an group will failover enough fast then the users not need to relogin to use the application.right?
Only if the failover takes long time,the users should relogin.
On parallel service group there is no floating IP.right.
The chain is like:user->application->oraclerac.But between application and ORAC there is an software balancer.right?So some transactions that come from the application go through an oracle instance and other transactions go through other oracle instance from ORAC.right?
So if an box with an orac instance fails,the transactions go through the other box.
thanks so much.
Solved! Go to Solution.
07-09-2014 10:41 PM
If an group will failover enough fast then the users not need to relogin to use the application.right?
Only if the failover takes long time,the users should relogin.
>>> Incorrect, if application is a failover application & configured in cluster, application will be completely offline before it is onlined on second node so users may need to relogin. Time is not a factor here.As application will be offline & online again, session termination is likely to happen.
On parallel service group there is no floating IP.right.
>>> Correct,parallel service groups will have individual IPs, for e.g oracle RAC database will have IPs for listener on each node where for database to connect to parallel instances.
The chain is like:user->application->oraclerac.But between application and ORAC there is an software balancer.right?So some transactions that come from the application go through an oracle instance and other transactions go through other oracle instance from ORAC.right?
>>> Correct, RAC will take care of load balancing between two instances
So if an box with an orac instance fails,the transactions go through the other box.
>>> Ideally yes, if I remember correctly, you need to configure TAF (transparent application failover) in TNS to enable seamless movement, otherwise users may need to reattempt connection
G
07-10-2014 01:12 AM
These all depends on the application - below are some scenarios for an application where you are entering some data , when a service group fails over
The above results may vary depending on how long it takes to failover, compared with the timeouts used in the application - i.e if the application has a timeout of 3 mins to reconnect if it looses connection, then obviously VCS need to failover group in less than 3 mins (including detection time). Also it may depend on what the application is doing - if the group fails over just as application client sends data that has being inputted, then the application client code MAY resend data if "send" doesn't work or it may not.
So it all depends on how the application is coded and configured and the same is true of Oracle RAC - it depends on how you configure the client.
Mike
07-10-2014 03:16 AM
This is more an Oracle question than VCS - my understanding is most of the configuation is done in the oracle client (i.e the client load balanced) - I know of at least 3 methods (but I am not an Oracle DB expert so this maybe incorrect):
As I say, I know Symantec products, not Oracle, so above may be wrong.
Mike
07-10-2014 03:42 AM
Some sample configurations can be found here, this should clear your doubt on dependency
https://sort.symantec.com/public/documents/sfha/6.1/solaris/productguides/html/vcs_oracle_agent/apbs01.htm
so for every parallel instance i need an software balancer.right?
>> Please read through previous response provided, Once you install RAC, load balance feature will come automatically, its not that you need to install something separtely on each node
G
07-10-2014 03:44 AM
Also look at
https://sort.symantec.com/public/documents/sfha/6.1/solaris/productguides/html/vcs_oracle_agent/apbs02.htm
This depicts graphical representation of dependency
G
07-10-2014 05:41 AM
Just to clarify:
Your application client will communicate through a virtual IP to an application process on the server and this process will have associated memory about the connection state, so when the application process fails over to another system, the application process is now a different process available on the same virtual IP and it will most likely not have the same in-memory state about the connection, so the application client needs to have the logic to:
Note this is not the same as if your application client lost access due to network outage, as in this scenario, it would need to do step 1 above "Wait for the process to become available again" while network recovers, but it would probably not need to do 2, as the process still exists (unless the application server process timed out and dropped connection).
Mike
07-10-2014 08:45 AM
As before it depends on what the client and application are, how they are configured and in some instances how long the failover time is. i.e in for some clients and applications it won't matter how quick the failover is, the client will need to reconnect, but for other applications the client and/or application server component will have timeouts so the failover time matters.
Mike
07-09-2014 10:32 PM
Hi,
Oracle handles the connection to the databases and the failover of the clients if there is a connections issue.
http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/database/options/clustering/overview/scan-129069.pdf
07-09-2014 10:41 PM
If an group will failover enough fast then the users not need to relogin to use the application.right?
Only if the failover takes long time,the users should relogin.
>>> Incorrect, if application is a failover application & configured in cluster, application will be completely offline before it is onlined on second node so users may need to relogin. Time is not a factor here.As application will be offline & online again, session termination is likely to happen.
On parallel service group there is no floating IP.right.
>>> Correct,parallel service groups will have individual IPs, for e.g oracle RAC database will have IPs for listener on each node where for database to connect to parallel instances.
The chain is like:user->application->oraclerac.But between application and ORAC there is an software balancer.right?So some transactions that come from the application go through an oracle instance and other transactions go through other oracle instance from ORAC.right?
>>> Correct, RAC will take care of load balancing between two instances
So if an box with an orac instance fails,the transactions go through the other box.
>>> Ideally yes, if I remember correctly, you need to configure TAF (transparent application failover) in TNS to enable seamless movement, otherwise users may need to reattempt connection
G
07-10-2014 12:29 AM
hi,
so the session will be terminated on one node of failover scenarion,and this means that all the network connetions to that group on this node will gone.
RAC will take care of load balancing between two instances.-So the load balancer will be on the box with every orac instance?In this case if we have 2 boxes with 2 instances (orac),there will be 1 load balancer in an box and other one in other box?To me this sound strange,because load balancer should runs on a box between aplication box and the 2 boxes with orac.
thanks so much.
07-10-2014 01:12 AM
These all depends on the application - below are some scenarios for an application where you are entering some data , when a service group fails over
The above results may vary depending on how long it takes to failover, compared with the timeouts used in the application - i.e if the application has a timeout of 3 mins to reconnect if it looses connection, then obviously VCS need to failover group in less than 3 mins (including detection time). Also it may depend on what the application is doing - if the group fails over just as application client sends data that has being inputted, then the application client code MAY resend data if "send" doesn't work or it may not.
So it all depends on how the application is coded and configured and the same is true of Oracle RAC - it depends on how you configure the client.
Mike
07-10-2014 01:19 AM
we are not talking about a physical load balancer, rather this is a capability of Oracle RAC software itself to balance connections.
G
07-10-2014 02:18 AM
Hi,
In this case then i like to understand the path from user(client computer) to orac.
client->application->listener->orac software load balancer->IP of oracle instance.right?
so the first time an database is accessed the listener take the query,but next the client queries go directly to the IP instance.right?
so for every parallel instance i need an software balancer.right?
is there any command to veify from client that an oracle instance works?
07-10-2014 03:16 AM
This is more an Oracle question than VCS - my understanding is most of the configuation is done in the oracle client (i.e the client load balanced) - I know of at least 3 methods (but I am not an Oracle DB expert so this maybe incorrect):
As I say, I know Symantec products, not Oracle, so above may be wrong.
Mike
07-10-2014 03:42 AM
Some sample configurations can be found here, this should clear your doubt on dependency
https://sort.symantec.com/public/documents/sfha/6.1/solaris/productguides/html/vcs_oracle_agent/apbs01.htm
so for every parallel instance i need an software balancer.right?
>> Please read through previous response provided, Once you install RAC, load balance feature will come automatically, its not that you need to install something separtely on each node
G
07-10-2014 03:44 AM
Also look at
https://sort.symantec.com/public/documents/sfha/6.1/solaris/productguides/html/vcs_oracle_agent/apbs02.htm
This depicts graphical representation of dependency
G
07-10-2014 04:25 AM
Hi Gaurav,
I asked my first question about login again when an group failover,as Mike written,that there on the cliend side the channel with application is still open for a certain period of the time,so maybe there will not be the need to login again after the group failover to other node if the time of failover is short enough,so the channels open on client are still open.
Please what is your opinion?Still the same?
thanks so much.
07-10-2014 04:30 AM
also the listener takes the transaction requests and send them to the database processes using the IP of this database instance?
07-10-2014 05:03 AM
Hi,
Your questions really relate to Oracle, not SFRAC. Maybe you should check with DBA about these topics as you seem new to them :)
07-10-2014 05:25 AM
Hi,
No problem but my last question remains.
Hi Gaurav,
I asked my first question about login again when an group failover,as Mike written,that there on the cliend side the channel with application is still open for a certain period of the time,so maybe there will not be the need to login again after the group failover to other node if the time of failover is short enough,so the channels open on client are still open.
Please what is your opinion?Still the same?
thanks so much.
07-10-2014 05:41 AM
Just to clarify:
Your application client will communicate through a virtual IP to an application process on the server and this process will have associated memory about the connection state, so when the application process fails over to another system, the application process is now a different process available on the same virtual IP and it will most likely not have the same in-memory state about the connection, so the application client needs to have the logic to:
Note this is not the same as if your application client lost access due to network outage, as in this scenario, it would need to do step 1 above "Wait for the process to become available again" while network recovers, but it would probably not need to do 2, as the process still exists (unless the application server process timed out and dropped connection).
Mike
07-10-2014 08:30 AM
Hi Mike,
Of course what you written here is correct,but my query is "should the client to login again if the failover time is very short,so the channel in client is still open?
07-10-2014 08:45 AM
As before it depends on what the client and application are, how they are configured and in some instances how long the failover time is. i.e in for some clients and applications it won't matter how quick the failover is, the client will need to reconnect, but for other applications the client and/or application server component will have timeouts so the failover time matters.
Mike