Incremental backup is almost as big as the full

[manussnair]

Hi,

I have a windows 2012 R2 cluster with Windows StorageSpaces(dedup enabled). I have 2 drives X and Y , and multiple shares under each drives. I have many number of policies which have been structured to take the backup of one share in X and 1 share in Y. There is a strange thing happening with many of these policies , which is , the incremental backup is almost the same as the full backup in many of these. Im finding it really tough to troubleshoot this as there is no changes happening in the source data. Anyhelp would be highly appreciated.

Master : 7.6.0.4 , Windows 2012 R2

Media : 7.6.0.4 , RHEL 6.5

One of the policies is :

PS E:\Program Files\Veritas\NetBackup\bin\admincmd> ./bppllist Win_StorageSpaces_01
CLASS Win_StorageSpaces_01 *NULL* 0 760000 0 *NULL*
NAMES
INFO 13 0 0 0 *NULL* 0 0 2147483647 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1406899844 EE4EDD04A77E4A8883BDA40D60A18BAC 1 1 60 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 1 3 0 68 0 28800 0 0 0 0 1
KEY *NULL*
BCMD *NULL*
RCMD *NULL*
RES WSS_Backup *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
POOL NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup NetBackup
FOE 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
SHAREGROUP *ANY*
DATACLASSIFICATION *NULL*
CLIENT ca1fs01-ib Windows-x64 Windows2008 0 0 0 0 *NULL*
INCLUDE NEW_STREAM
INCLUDE X:\wss_autotierpool1_vol1\Shares\
INCLUDE NEW_STREAM
INCLUDE Y:\wss_autotierpool2_vol1\shares\
SCHED Full 0 1 604800 8 0 0 0 *NULL* 0 1 0 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0
SCHEDCALENDAR
SCHEDWIN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 61200 216000 0 0
SCHEDRES *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
SCHEDPOOL *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
SCHEDRL 8 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
SCHEDFOE 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
SCHEDSG *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
SCHED Incremental 1 1 604800 3 0 0 0 *NULL* 0 1 0 0 0 0 -1 0 0 0
SCHEDCALENDAR
SCHEDWIN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
SCHEDRES *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
SCHEDPOOL *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
SCHEDRL 3 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
SCHEDFOE 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
SCHEDSG *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL* *NULL*
PS E:\Program Files\Veritas\NetBackup\bin\admincmd> ./bppllist Win_StorageSpaces_01 -L

Policy Name:       Win_StorageSpaces_01
Options:           0x0
template:          FALSE
audit_reason:         ?
Names:             (none)
Policy Type:       MS-Windows (13)
Active:            yes
Effective date:    08/01/2014 06:30:44
Client Compress:   no
Follow NFS Mnts:   no
Backup netwrk drvs:no
Collect TIR info:      no
Mult. Data Stream: yes
Perform Snapshot Backup:   no
Snapshot Method:           (none)
Snapshot Method Arguments: (none)
Perform Offhost Backup:    no
Backup Copy:               0
Use Data Mover:            no
Data Mover Type:           2
Use Alternate Client:      no
Alternate Client Name:     (none)
Use Virtual Machine:      0
Hyper-V Server Name:     (none)
Enable Instant Recovery:   no
Policy Priority:   0
Max Jobs/Policy:   Unlimited
Disaster Recovery: 0
Collect BMR Info:  no
Keyword:           (none specified)
Data Classification:       -
Residence is Storage Lifecycle Policy:    no
Client Encrypt:    no
Checkpoint:        yes
      Interval:    60
Residence:         WSS_Backup
Volume Pool:       NetBackup
Server Group:      *ANY*
Granular Restore Info:  no
Exchange Source attributes:              no
Exchange DAG Preferred Server: (none defined)
Application Discovery:      no
Discovery Lifetime:      28800 seconds
ASC Application and attributes: (none defined)
Generation:      68
Ignore Client Direct:  yes
Enable Metadata Indexing:  no
Index server name:  NULL
Use Accelerator:  no
Optimized Backup:  no
Client/HW/OS/Pri/DMI/CIT:  ca1fs01-ib Windows-x64 Windows2008 0 0 0 0 ?
Include:           NEW_STREAM
Include:           X:\wss_autotierpool1_vol1\Shares\
Include:           NEW_STREAM
Include:           Y:\wss_autotierpool2_vol1\shares\
Schedule:              Full
  Type:                FULL (0)
  Calendar sched: Enabled
   Included Dates-----------
       No days of week entered
   Excluded Dates----------
      No specific exclude dates entered
      No exclude days of week entered
  Retention Level:     8 (1 year)
  u-wind/o/d:          0 0
  Incr Type:           DELTA (0)
  Alt Read Host:       (none defined)
  Max Frag Size:       0 MB
  Synthetic:           0
  Checksum Change Detection: 0
  PFI Recovery:        0
  Maximum MPX:         1
  Number Copies:       1
  Fail on Error:       0
  Residence:           (specific storage unit not required)
  Volume Pool:         (same as policy volume pool)
  Server Group:        (same as specified for policy)
  Residence is Storage Lifecycle Policy:         0
  Schedule indexing:   0
  Daily Windows:
   Day         Open       Close       W-Open     W-Close
   Sunday      000:00:00  000:00:00
   Monday      000:00:00  000:00:00
   Tuesday     000:00:00  000:00:00
   Wednesday   000:00:00  000:00:00
   Thursday    000:00:00  000:00:00
   Friday      017:00:00  077:00:00   137:00:00  197:00:00 029:00:00
   Saturday    000:00:00  000:00:00
Schedule:              Incremental
  Type:                INCR (1)
  Calendar sched: Enabled
   Included Dates-----------
       No days of week entered
   Excluded Dates----------
      No specific exclude dates entered
      No exclude days of week entered
  Retention Level:     3 (1 month)
  u-wind/o/d:          0 0
  Incr Type:           DELTA (0)
  Alt Read Host:       (none defined)
  Max Frag Size:       0 MB
  PFI Recovery:        0
  Maximum MPX:         1
  Number Copies:       1
  Fail on Error:       0
  Residence:           (specific storage unit not required)
  Volume Pool:         (same as policy volume pool)
  Server Group:        (same as specified for policy)
  Residence is Storage Lifecycle Policy:         0
  Schedule indexing:   0
  Daily Windows:
   Day         Open       Close       W-Open     W-Close
   Sunday      000:00:00  000:00:00
   Monday      000:00:00  000:00:00
   Tuesday     000:00:00  000:00:00
   Wednesday   000:00:00  000:00:00
   Thursday    000:00:00  000:00:00
   Friday      000:00:00  000:00:00
   Saturday    000:00:00  000:00:00
PS E:\Program Files\Veritas\NetBackup\bin\admincmd>

Image list:

date	Time	Expires	Files	KB	Schedule	Type	Policy	Backup set
01/28/2015	17:27	01/28/2016	12678	85520298	Full	Backup	Win_StorageSpaces_01	Y:\wss_autotierpool2_vol1\shares
01/28/2015	17:27	01/28/2016	8	10485782	Full	Backup	Win_StorageSpaces_01	X:\wss_autotierpool1_vol1\Shares

date	Time	Expires	Files	KB	Schedule	Policy
02-03-15	10:52	03-06-15	7814	85011023	Differential	Win_StorageSpaces_01
02-03-15	10:52	03-06-15	4	12	Differential	Win_StorageSpaces_01

date	Time	Expires	Files	KB	Schedule	Policy
02-04-15	14:23	03-07-15	13561	89287019	Differential	Win_StorageSpaces_01
02-04-15	14:23	03-07-15	3	10	Differential	Win_StorageSpaces_01

[Marianne]

Are backups for this client based on Archive bit (NBU default)?

If so - is there anything on this client that could reset Archive bit?

Try to change to Incrementals based on timestamp in Host Properties -> Client -> Windows Client.

[Andy_Welburn]

"as there is no changes happening in the source data."

What is the actual source data? Flat files, database extensions, mail files?

Aside: I find the output of many commands (that have the option) to be much more readable with the -U option

[manussnair]

Yes..It is based on Archive bit. As per a symantec tech article, a combination of "Allow multiple streams" + Archive bit turned ON could cause the issue on 7.5 and 7.6 versions. but it also says, the issue is fixed as of version 7.6.0.3. Im running 7.6.0.4. Not sure whther to trust symantec or not

[manussnair]

Most of them are the applications dumps, engineering images, user home folders etc....

[Marianne]

I have learned not to trust Windows Archive bit. Try to change to Incrementals based on timestamp. If you feel the problem is with NBU, you have every right to open a support call with Symantec.

[Marianne]

Have you tried to change the Host Properties yet?

[manussnair]

Timestamp based backup is not a good solution for us as we have new files getting copied to the source always, which would have past mod time. As a workaround , we have removed the "allow multiple datastreams" and ran the backup, which seems to be working as of now.

[Marianne]

I cannot see how or why multiple data streams would be a solution.

But if you feel that it solved your issue - great!

[Seth_E]

What are the downsides of using timestamps instead of archive bit?

Any reason why you don't trust windows archive bit?

Also, if new files are being added daily (with past mod times) is timestamp still a good choice?

Seth

[manussnair]

Well, apparently even changing the multistreaming didnt work. Happened to see a MS technote that says the Windows 2012 Deduplication engine changes Archive bits of the file when it processes them. That could be a reason too.