REV/70 Drive, NTFS issues, No backups ever complete

[Dan_Neuwirth]

Hello all,

We're using a SATA REV 70 drive and BE 11d for Small Bus Servers on Windows SBS 2003R2, running on a Dell PowerEdge 2900 server.

When attempting to back up using the granular restore option, we're getting the famous V-79-57344-4608 "must use NTFS" error. It's driving me crazy.

As an IT consultant, I've recommended, installed and used Backup Exec in about 30 different installations for about five years, since around version 8 or so. This is the first time I've ever had significant "just can't back up no matter what I do" issues with BE, and I'm hoping that maybe it's a simple fix.

Most of my experience has been with DAT tapes (DDS4/DAT72). These two installations (both substantially identical) are my first Rev Drive installs. With great reviews and Iomega's well-crafted "look how great we work with Symantec Backup Exec" press releases, I decided to try it.

To be honest, I'm having difficulty calling this product "compatible" with Rev drives using the "Removeable Backup to Disk" device option. The products just don't seem to work well together--certainly not as well as I'm used to with DAT drives. When Granular Restore is turned off, I get the Rev disk ejecting itself on its own, at 100% completion, with the backup staying at "backing up" status forever, and upon attempting to cancel the backup I get the typical "cancel pending" status that never goes away, totally hung Backup Exec Job Engine service, requiring a reboot of this (full production) server.

Yes, I've even swallowed my pride and read the manual (even though I know the product well enough that I felt I didn't need to), and followed the "removeable backup to disk" options to the letter.

When the granular restore option is enabled, I get the NTFS complaint. This is ridiculous. I need to be able to have the confidence of knowing I can restore a single message, folder, or user's box, without having to restore "the entire Exchange store". This always worked with tapes (which, as far as I'm aware, don't use NTFS either). Why am I having this issue?

This is a Small Business Server, and BE 11d Small Business Edition. I'm not just backing up the files on my D: drive. I'm looking to get a simple, fully automated and complete backup of my ENTIRE server--including SharePoint Services, SQL Databases and of course, Exchange.

I called Symantec "Enterprise" Technical Support, and they told me that because it's a Dell-shipped OEM version, Symantec won't support the product, Call Dell. Never mind it's the identical product to a "retail" version. Dell tells me that they only provide Installation support, "call Symantec". Great. Congrats to both Symantec and Dell on their terrific support and ownership of a product.

How do I get around this Granular Support issue? I have yet to get a single successful backup in either of two different IT installations from it using ANY options whatsoever, granular restore or not.

I need to be able to restore individual messages or mailboxes from my backups, just like I've always been able to with prior small-biz versions of the BE product. I'm assuming by turning off the "granular restore" option, I lose that capability, right? In BE 9.x/10.x I was always able to restore individual boxes or messages. Why are we taking a step back with BE 11d? Why is 11d so unstable? I've never had these problems before and so it's totally caught me off guard here.

Help, anyone!?!?

-Dan

[Dan_Neuwirth]

Hello... Anyone... (hears own voice echo...)

I was under the impression from the forum title that this was a "moderated" forum, meaning that someone from Symantec actually checks in on occasion and sees to it that questions are answered.

Has anyone out there ever had ANY success backing up using BE 11d for Small Business Servers and Iomega REV drives? I'm seeing one fabulously-crafted joint press-release (link below) between Symantec and Iomega touting how wonderfully the BE product supports REV drives, yet as far as I can tell, because REV drives do not support NTFS, you cannot use the very features (granular backup) touted in the press-release with the REV drive, making the REV technology TOTALLY USELESS for backing up anything but a "My Documents" folder.

Can someone at Symantec please aticulate how this product was tested and verified to be remotely "compatible" with REV drives when perhaps the most significant feature (change) in the 11d product doesn't work with them? Can someone at Symantec please explain exactly how we're supposed to back up Exchange and SharePoint to a REV disk and have restores be remotely usable in a production environment?

Right now, I've invested $3000 between two different REV drive and Backup Exec setups (two different unrelated server installations), and have yet to get a single satisfactory backup out of either---and as far as I'm able to tell, this isn't a "bug", it's actually DESIGNED to not work.

For those who wish to read the press release: http://www.iomega.com/about/prreleases/2006/113006_rev_software.html

Symantec...? Anyone???

[shweta_rege]

Hello,


Kindly refer the following Documents;


"V-79-57344-4608 -The backup-to-disk folder that was specified for this job must be on a local NTFS volume. Create a new backup-to-disk folder on a local NTFS volume or modify the current folder, and then submit the job again" may occur during backup to a Backup to Disk folder.



http://support.veritas.com/docs/286216



Thank You,

Shweta

[Ken_Putnam]

Shweta -

If one cannot format a REV drive with NTFS, how exactly does telling him what he already knows help in any way?


Please read the entire thread before responding

[Dan_Neuwirth]

Hey, Shweta,

DO YOU HAVE A SOLUTION??? Perhaps your replies should include somewhat more thought, and less cut-and-paste.

Did you even read my original post?

Iomega REV drives do NOT support Symantec Backup Exec 11d as you all have advertized. Both Symantec and Iomega have issued joint press releases to the contrary.

Can you please check in to how to ACTUALLY solve the problem? Iomega has stated "Rev drives are 'natively' supported in Backup Exec". Symantec joined in on that press release.

Yet, Symantec states, "Granular Restore" (one of the highly touted supposedly "new" features of 11d) requires NTFS, which REV drives cannot be made to support per Iomega--REV drives only support UDF.

So the IS NO NATIVE SUPPORT IN 11D FOR REV DRIVES.

Can someone PLEASE TEST THE PRODUCT AND GET A PATCH THAT FIXES THIS???

I cannot believe I typed in my first posting on this topic over a week ago, and the only reply I've actually gotten is one reiterating back to me what the problem is in the first place. Your answer reminds me of a plumber who came to my house after I reported a leaking faucet, and upon arrival, told me my faucet was leaking: "Yup, it's a leak". Thanks. I knew that already. WHEN WILL YOU FIX IT???

Shweta, your reply was completely useless. Please try again.

-Dan

[Ken_Putnam]

Dan -

Technically Veritas/Symantec and Iomega are correct. You can use a Rev disk as a target for B2D on removable media natively..

You are just trying to push it a little further. But I agree that the response from Symantec should have been either

Sorry you cannot do Granular backups to a REV drive, just standard backups

or

We are aware of this problem and are working on a solution

Perhaps one of the newer Non Indian Subcontinent techs will see this thread and respond

[yui_thjin]

hi dan

not sure if any help
but i am a long time REV user (over 200 drives in use - ATAPI, SATA, SCSI 35gb, 70gb) - i have been quite happy with them
i normally use Dantz Retrospect although i do have BE installations
i don't believe i have encountered this specific circumstance (granular backup - on Rev)
but i have encountered a strange issue with the dell PE2900
i cant seem to get it to format tapes - using iomega's tools / right click
short and long i get format failed - although i can read, write, delete normally
i tried known working drives, with known working disks on 2 different PE2900, installed a clean OS, latest rev firmware & drivers, win2k3 stnd r2, win 2k3 ent r2, removed my RAC card (thought might be virtual drives interfering)
to no avail - i tried rev SATA (using on board), rev ATAPI (using on board), rev SCSI (using pcix card), rev SCSI (using PCI-E card) both Rev 35, and rev 70
(i keep all these in stock - and when i encountered issue - scoured the web and closest result was yours - i started to wonder and threw my whole team at it
i have them working fine on pe 2800 2850 1800 1850 and many others

though might be some issue with getting some low level access

plan on calling dell & iomega (i have gold level support with iomega, and am a dell certified reseller)Monday will keep you posted of any update

[Brooke_Saxman]

We are having the same issue. We are using a USB Iomega REV 70GB drive and BE 11d for Small Bus Servers on Windows SBS 2003R2. These run on Intel Pentium D 3.4 GHz systems with 2GB of ram.

Backing up to the REV drive works correctly unless we use the granular restore feature. In this case we get the Final error: 0xe0001200 - This operation requires a backup-to-disk folder on a local NTFS volume on the media server.

I have gone through the article http://support.veritas.com/docs/286216. It looks to me that the granular restore feature will not work with the iomega REV drives. We were planning this hardware/software combination as a standard install for our customers. Can we get a confirmation that this will not work? Also are there any plans to fix this in the future? This will greatly affect are decistion as to whether or not we move forward with this combination of hardware and software.

Thank you,

Brooke

[Michael_McKenne]

A few members of Symantec staff do post daily.   Usually 8-5.   If you need immediate support, call them and open a call.

USB Rev drives might not be a good backup target. 

Message Edited by Michael McKenney on 04-02-200707:08 PM

[Hywel_Mallett]

So it all works backing up to a Rev drive except for GRT?
Personally I would just not use GRT then. Or alternatively run a B2D job for Exchange, and backup the B2D folder to the Rev drive (I assume you can't duplicate a GRT job?).
If you use Exchange's deleted items retention, you might not need GRT anyway. I've never had the need to restore a mailbox or a mailbox item.

[Brooke_Saxman]

Thank you Hywel

We've tried the B2D option and it works, but we have two issues with it. One we have not been able to find out how to overwrite the job. The second issue is that some of our customers do not have enough free disk space to make a copy of all of their data before writing it to the disk. Because of this, GRT to the Iomega is still our best option.

If you have any suggestions to allow for overwriting the jobs with B2D, that would help. We do very much want to get the grt to work, we have run into issues that require single restores for customers.

Thanks,

Brooke

[Hywel_Mallett]

Create a new media set with a short overwrite protection period, and target your B2D jobs to this media set. They should get overwritten then.

[looknow12]

I am having a similar problem to a Linksys NSS4000 Network Attached Storage device.

The backup only fails when backing up Exchange Server.  Has anyone found a resolution to this?

[TJ_Moore]

 I too, am faced with this problem.  I am a firm believer in using tape drives as a backup medium, but my boss doesn't like it because the tape drives cost is "too high" so I have to mess around with REV drives, USB drives etc and make a decent backup out of garbage.  I liked BE before they went to this GRT.  Now I don't think its worth it.  Better to put huge drives in a RAID 5 and configure your Exchange for 30 or more days deleted recovery (BUT instruct your users NOT to use shift key when deleting or you won't have the email to recovery from delete items) But I am getting off the REV subject, the only way I've found is to make a backup to the my NTFS formatted DATA drive then another job to back that up to the REV drive.  My test for this is currently running so hopefully this double backup can perform the same as a single backup to tape.

[dacomputerguy]

It's kind of Bizarre that nobody has answered this, from Symantec, Iomega, or whoever ....
Here is the secret. It goes against intuition, but what I did, was do the backups with the destination of the default device called 'IOMEGA1' , NOT ... I repeat NOT the "REMOVEABLE BACKUP-To-DISK FOLDER'.
- By default Windows does not support what it thinks of as removeable disks as NTFS formatted drives.
Iomega REV Disks have to be UDF formatted drives. 
Dont tell Backup Exec it is a removeable drive, just the default drive called IOMEGA1 and it works just fine. Give it a try, but it works for Backup Exec 12.5